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Posted by lumper
- May 09, 2011, 19:56:36 PMThanks again everyone.
Lump
Posted by VN1500
- May 09, 2011, 14:39:01 PMYippee!...Glad to hear Lump!
Ride safe & enjoy!
Ron
Posted by chief
- May 09, 2011, 14:20:38 PMYep and you always need to start with the easy stuff first... that clutch switch connector has been the cause of more than one -non-start situation .
Really glad that was the problem.
Posted by Troll
- May 09, 2011, 14:17:46 PMThe best fixes are the ones that help you learn without costing too much 
Posted by lumper
- May 09, 2011, 14:13:59 PMThank you guys so much for all the tips and help.
I got it running!!
I cant stop smiling either.
You guys, even on mothers day were there for me and spent a lot of time pondering my problem, I cant tell you enough how much that means to me and how thankful I am you are all here.
So I walked back through all the steps that led to the bike not starting.
In my excitement I realized I forgot what started all this.
I installed an under the bar mirror that clamps on the bars.
Well dont you know that the mount is exactly where that plug under the clutch is.
I looked more carefully after removing the mirror and sure enough, I had loosened the plug while installing the mirror and never knew it, or for that matter I never knew the switch was there an that it would contribute to not starting.
I was really freaking out since I couldn't understand how the bike went from fine to nothing.
I knew I must have done something but what?
Anyway after I put the mirror on the other day I thought, now would be a good time to polish the bike before a ride and then I will get some pics with the new mirrors, well when it wouldn't start I never once thought about the mirror until you guys pointed out that I should check that plug carefully.
I learned a lot about diagnostics on this bike, things to look or, where so many things are I never knew existed, etc..
It was a truly winning experience for me.
And the satisfaction that it wasn't a relay, a starter or my battery is even better.
This did prompt me to test my battery though and see it showed less than adequate cca's so I am going to replace it this week anyway for good measure.
I got so inspired I fabricated a couple of brackets and installed my air horns and I also cut off some threads I needed to install some female threaded spikes into my stock mirror mounts and painted it all too, so I am now just literally waiting for paint to dry and then I am heading out to take a ride and see how everything feels, sounds, looks and drives.
Lump
Posted by Troll
- May 09, 2011, 13:47:36 PMforgot to attach the schematic...duhhh
Posted by Troll
- May 09, 2011, 13:43:20 PMAs you can see the system does not include any kind of automotive solenoid, or even a starter clutch ("bendix"), as such. The starter is constantly engaged but does not spin until energized. There is a 1 way clutch that disengages after the engine starts.
Posted by lumper
- May 09, 2011, 12:17:08 PMOk, cool I am going to check again now.
I got a battery charger this morning but my luck it is old and doesn't work, lol.
I am going to check the switches and see if thats it, if not I am going to buy a replacement battery in a day or two, if thats not it at least I know I have a good properly charged battery to then run the tests concerning the relays and stuff.
Thanks, fingers crosses.
Lump
Posted by chief
- May 09, 2011, 10:23:03 AMYes, the battery can have enough juice to handle lighting but not spin the starter... its happened on both my GW and Drifter... same year! Replaced both batteries as a result. One would charge but fail under load. the other would charge but lose the ability to turn the starter after sitting about 10 minutes. Both batteries were 6 years old. Go figure.
Just mess around up there around the clutch lever/switch box. There are connectors there.. I had this happen after doing some work on the bike. If the connector isn't on nice and tight it will prevent the bike from starting. All those things should be checked before replacing anything.
Posted by lumper
- May 09, 2011, 10:08:16 AMTroll,
Thanks I am going to check it now.
IF you want to send me the schematics, my email is lumper@snet.net
Thanks again.
Lump
Posted by Troll
- May 09, 2011, 08:44:07 AMThe plug is on the underside of the clutch perch, plugging in under the hose. Be sure it's pushed all the way in. I can email you a schematic of the starter circuit.
Posted by lumper
- May 08, 2011, 19:25:43 PMis that the plug under he control and lever or you mean the actual contact point for the clutch?
One last question for tonight.
Is it possible that even though the battery has enough cca (123) to run my horns and lights that it just doesn't have enough to engage the cylinoid so it wont even start the starter?
And with that is there still a chance that a new fully charged battery might just fire it up?
Or is that a pipe dream at this point do you think?
Thanks guys, I really appreciate your time and help on this, tomorrow I am going to run through some tests but I feel like without a good battery it might be a waste of time.
I can grab a charger from my mom tomorrow and leave the battery on it and see if it will take a charge or not.
Lump
Posted by Troll
- May 08, 2011, 19:08:28 PMCheck to be sure the plug on the clutch lever is all the way in and tight. all the current for the starter relay has to pass this switch.
When I got mine, the wires were just slightly pulled out and it wouldn't turn over (crank) even with a fully charged battery. Neutral light was on, side stand up or down, makes no difference, if this bugger isn't making contact.
Posted by lumper
- May 08, 2011, 18:36:12 PMSorry Chief we posted at the same time I missed that long diagnostic, thanks alot.
I will hit it again tomorrow when have light again.
Also you said, You will need to disconnect and test each switch one by one...
How do I test them ?
locate them and disconnect them and inspect ? what else can I do to test them?
To clarify from before, I said side cover, I meant the right side air cover I guess it is called, the ports that the throttle control are on the top and then in the middle are two cylinders with lines running to them and they are wired with plugs on the bottom, these seem to click when I hit the start button, I can touch them and feel it.
I am going to go through all the tests you gave me though and see whats up, I cant get a new battery until Weds or Thursday so I wont be able to see if that is the problem.
It seems more unlikely that it is a battery now though and more likely a relay or switch or short somewhere possibly I guess.
Lump
Posted by lumper
- May 08, 2011, 18:15:16 PMWell when I get my ear really close and stretch my ape like arms across the bike to start it the click I hear made me take the right side cover off to look and see what was in there, but it definitely seems up high and center not out front on the bottom, definitely dont think anything is getting to the starter though.
I brought home a tester from my moms just now but I really have no idea how to use it, it is a multi tester ac/dc/volts and ohms, I thought maybe I could test the cylinoid or starter if I could get to the wires.
I read somewhere online when someone else was having this exact issue they ran a bypass direct from the battery to the starter to make sure it wasnt the starter and I was wondering if I should try bypassing anything like the kickstand sensor or anything.
So the relay is under the right side cover?
I had it off and saw two valve looking things, lol sorry, I assumed they had something to do with the fuel system.
What should I do with the relay to determine if it is the problem?
bypass it, replace it, ?
Thanks again for all your help too, I really appreciate it, I just want to ride.
Lump