Spokes and tubeless tires

[Troll]

So far, they have been really good. 4,000+ miles and no measurable wear on the front, and only about 1/32 off the rear. No funny chevron wear on the front tire, and they don't follow rain grooves or steel deck bridges. I'll tell you more when I can get out and ride, again. Right now, they are expecting 38 d F with freezing rain...

[ChilliDrift]

Troll has some great info here about those CMDR 2's

http://www.vulcandrifterriders.com/forum/index.php?topic=16657.msg27825#msg27825

[John Hopkins]

I found my next tires Michelin Commander 11s they are tubed tires marked TT and have a long life.

John.

[jmbo]

Actually, tubes in a tubeless tire gives you an extra level of safety - IMHO. Blow-outs are less likely with a tubed tire. And since the tire is tubeless (based on the type of failure), you will keep air in the tire longer  - which may make a very big difference in your situation.

Good point!

[chief]

Actually, tubes in a tubeless tire gives you an extra level of safety - IMHO. Blow-outs are less likely with a tubed tire. And since the tire is tubeless (based on the type of failure), you will keep air in the tire longer  - which may make a very big difference in your situation.

[darkdrifter]

I prefer to run tubeless so I can carry a plug and co2 kit.
If I where to get a flat at a time and place where just making a phone call is more practical than doing a repair on the side of the road, then that is what I would do instead of using the tire kit, IF, it was a tire with decent tread left, worth saving.
In my years of riding so far, I have only had one flat on the road that went down fast.  every other time I've picked up a screw, nail, etc.. it leaked down slow and I was able to make it home or to my destination.
the time it went down fast (cbr 1000f), a friend of mine I was riding with had a plug and co2 kit with him.
We plugged the tire and discharged the co2 bottles into it.  they didn't fill the tire all the way back up to the correct psi, but it was inflated enough to safely make it to the next gas station and inflate there.
I'm not a big fan of riding with plugs in my mc tires, so I did replace or patch it (can't remember which)
given the amount of $$$ and pita factor that would have been caused to not be able to "fix" that tire on the side of the road that particular day, made it a life saver (long story).

my 2010  indian came new from the factory with tubeless spoke rims.  many harleys, if not all (not sure) by now are tubeless spokes.  I'm clueless on the metrics.
I carry a tire and tube kit with me at all times.   I've overheard many a rider say how worthless those tire kits are, I just usually smile and go along with it if it appears I'm talking to somebody not worth trying to converse with.  For others, all I can do is tell them my one particular experiance.

as mentioned earlier in this thread, converting a tube spoke rim is best if it has the "safety bead" built into it.  however, I know many that have converted without that bead and have thousands and thousands of miles with no issues.

I had my tires off my gf's drifter 800 rims a month or so ago, and I could have swore they did have a safety bead (albeit small).
I could be wrong though.  I honestly wasn't really focused or concerned with it at the time since I planned to convert at a later time.
I guess when its time for new tires, I'll take a closer look.
Since I'm the one that blasted and powdercoated them, it is kinda pathetic that I can't remember, lol!  but now reading one of the above post has me second guessing myself.  I even went and looked at my own picture, but its to hard to tell.
I'm sure many here can confirm yes or no.  I'm still just a noob to these bikes.
having said that, if there is no safety bead on the 800 drifter, then I will not be converting to tubeless.
as far as which is better, tubeless has way more pros than cons vs tubes, but thats just my opinion based on my particular riding

[CDNRatMan]

  you need WWW on the Drifter it is the look....lol.....and the therapy of cleaning them once a week....therapy.....

[Troll]

https://www.denniskirk.com/metzeler/rear-me-880-130-90hb-16-blackwall-tire.p540239.prd/540239.sku
If you require a tube, no problem....Just 1 example. My Michelins say the same thing...fit tube if needed.

[pcarrell]

I do know the Continental does still make some TT tires, but I didn't look to see if they were the right size.

[jmbo]

Talked to my tire guy and he said first I have no choice but to run tubes and rim strips in my Drifter wheels.  Second, yes most tires these days are TL rated because many of today's bikes run alloy wheels but you can run tubes in them. I asked him about "sealing" the spoke nipples to run TL without tubes.  He gave me the same story about the different in the rim design.  Finally he said since if it is OK to run tubes in TL tires, what's the big deal. Why not run them. For $25 bucks a tube and a couple bucks a pop for rim strips for something that you know will work, why risk it. 

[pcarrell]

To be honest, I've had Continental Milestone WWW's and Metzeler 880 WWW's, and they're both TL rated and I've had no problems.  I change the rim strips and tubes every time.  I haven't had any issues, but I'm not a knee dragger.  I'm pretty mild in my riding.

[John Hopkins]

OK now that we have established that we should use tubed tires on spoked wheels, here is the real question..What tires are marked TT these days, because I am having trouble finding them...

As far as Avon is concerned the cobra is the one they recommend, but that is TL rated..

John.

[John Hopkins]

It seems to me that you have the same views I have, that the manufacturers thought about what they were doing and had good reasons for doing it..

I'm beginning to like this machine..

John.

[chief]

Yep, its important to recognize that rims are different from tubed vs tubeless tires...

Here are two pics illustrating what Troll is saying. (Thanks to Patten for the pics).

[Troll]

If you look at the pic from Darkdrifter, showing the wheel he powdercoated, and enlarge it (ctrl key +) you will see there is no bead retaining rib.

[chief]

Most modern rims are for tubeless tires... as troll says older spoke rims might not work with tubeless tires.

As to converting from spokes... there is a process which welds each hole (but still doesn't make it a tubeless rim). And, there are spoke style wheels that will work... they aren't really spokes. Plus you can use non-spoke wheels...
http://www.vulcandrifterriders.com/wheels.html
http://www.vulcandrifterriders.com/makwheel.html
http://www.vulcandrifterriders.com/reviewpost/showcat.php?cat=55

[pcarrell]

Gadget has a link on his site ( http://www.gadgetjq.com/tww.htm ) but I'm not brave enough for it. 

[Troll]

There are some considerations for mounting tires on wheels far beyond merely sealing the spoke holes. The basic design of the wheel rim is the single most important factor. Tubeless wheels have a bead retention rib cast into the wheel that is supposed to prevent tire bead unseating during high side loads or in a low pressure situation. Tube wheels do not have this bead retention rib. This does not always work, but without it, there is nothing to retain the bead at all.
http://blog.unsafemotorcycles.com/2010/08/dunlop-402-among-array-of-problem.html
I've don a lot of research on this subject in the last couple of years due to 2 pending law suits.

[John Hopkins]

Here's a question for some of you that ride long distances..

Have any of you converted your spoked wheels to run tubeless tires, I know it is sometimes done on bicycles and lighter motorcycles, but the 1500 drifter is a very heavy bike and I am more interested in safety than I thought I was..

So if you have converted to tubeless I would be interested in any problems..and if you haven't is it because you think it might be unsafe on curves at speed..

Thoughts and opinions would be welcome..

John.