1999 1500 Drifter no start condition (SOLVED - BLOWN ECU FUSE.)

[Troll]

Don't worry, for now, that the efi light won't flash codes, that's actually a good thing. You are going to have to measure some voltages. take off the speedo cover and find the fuel pump connector. Should be 4 wires...blk/w and rd/w....measure across them by back probing the connectors with a sewing needle inserted in the connector between the insulation and the seal. Turn on the key, and you should get 12.5V or more, for 3 seconds, then 0V. If the voltage is correct then the ecm and relay are doing their job. If the voltage is not correct, disconnect the plug and measure the voltage at key on on the red wire and ground your meter to the engine. should be 12.5V. If the voltage is correct now, then the pump is open or the ground circuit to the computer is incomplete. Look at this diagram and follow the circuit...

[pcarrell]

Those ECU's are strange beasts.  When mine started to go the horn came on and wouldn't shut off.

[45 Bravo]

Thats quite an offer Chili, but if it is your primary, i don't want to take you off line from riding while it is in transit both ways.

I found one on ebay for $150, (but it was just listed yesterday and has 5 days left hopefully no one bids too high)

I would prefer to try someones spare.

Ian

[ChilliDrift]

I'll send you mine 45.

[45 Bravo]

I again followed the procedure listed here http://www.vulcandrifterriders.com/ECUFaultCodes.html
as suggested by Chief.

It still shows the same as before, instead of the FI light flashing the codes when i turn the key on after jumpering the pin, the FI light just stays on.

So, That is where i am at, The bike is my only means of transportation, but as my wife had surgery, then me(a week ago) it hasn't been an issue, but it will be shortly when i return to work.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

thanks.

45 Bravo

[45 Bravo]

And the Fight continues,
Ding Ding, Round 2.

I got the new key switch in today, put it in, same problem.
same lights..

I can say this, If i put my ear to the tank when i turn on the key, i can hear a electric motor running faintly, it is making a sound like it is turning over maybe 10 revs per second ( read that as i can hear something going dut, dut, dut, about 10 times a second,, and only very faintly.
not the normal buzz sound you can hear while seated on the bike.

Any ideas?

in talking to the kawasaki dealer in the next larger town, he thinks the ECU is going out, and the noise i am hearing is the pump trying to turn over but being supplied with extremely low voltage from the ecu.

He suggest i bring it there and let them put it on their diagnostic machine. ($70)
Even he admits it will sometimes show what is up, and sometimes it won't.

Due to the timing, cams and such according to him, the replacement ecu will have to be from a drifter, the other Fi bikes wont work.

Anyone here have any suggestions?

Anyone got an extra ECU they would loan me long enough to check it out?
I will pay all shipping & fees.

45 Bravo

[CDNRatMan]

   ok your back on my lottery list again.......

[45 Bravo]

I would never call your house the rat shack. A Drifter lives there!

As a ham radio operator, we have our radio/work room the "ham shack", when radio shack trade marked the shack name, they forced autoshack to change their name to autozone. And tried to sue over the ham shack name..

I try to do as little trade with them as possible..

But I would never call your abode a shack...

45 Bravo

[CDNRatMan]

  I never sold you nothing so leave me out of this problem......

[45 Bravo]

I ordered the key switch today, will take a week to come in.
I jumpered the pin 37, but when i turned on the switch, all the lights came on again and stayed on, no flashing from the FI light (and i waited for a minute with the ignition on. )
I bought a new resistor today from rat shack, (100 ohms, 2watts) $1.29 for 2 of them, and will play with the old switch after i get in the new one.  Maybe there is a emergency fix there.

Thanks guys, I will keep you posted.

ian

[chief]

You misread the instructions.

The ECU instructions tell you if during the light check the FI light doesn't come on you have a lighting circuit problem. It also says if the FI light comes on while the bike is running you have a DFI SYSTEM problem.  Once you jumper appropriately as long as that FI light comes on after a reset you have a fault code in there. There may be more than one.
Evidence points to an ignition switch problem. I'd replace that, but some folks prefer to eliminate all other possibilities before replacing parts.
[size=78%] [/size]

[Troll]

I'm sending you all bills.....
Seriously... Diagnostics  as well as repair is what I did for my working life..keeps your brain working. Armed with books, and 40+ years of experience, I'll help where I can, or at least try.

[ChilliDrift]

If sooo, you need to be one the receiving end of the donations pool. And that's cool.

[Troll]

I'm only in it for the money....

[ChilliDrift]

Troll.... this is why your a hell of a man.  Your a fine American. A true biker that takes the time to help a brother out! 

[45 Bravo]

I did those things last night, I even replaced the negative ground cable with a new one I had bought a few months ago.
Checked key wire connections.
No go, then did ecu test, all the lights stayed on.
So the instructions in the earlier post said the problem is the DFI if that happens.

I talked to the local shop today, and told them what was happening,  and the symptoms.
I never mentioned the key switch possibity.

The owner said they have had 3 fi vulcans with similar symptoms over the years, and he said after much parts changing, and labor, it was the key switch on all three..

I guess I will just cough up the cash for the new key.

But with my luck, it will be the pump...

I still try what troll suggested after I get the new key in to see if I can figure out a way or mod to bypass that feature for future riders..

Ian

[Troll]

sure don't want to steer you wrong, but it's kinda hard doing this over the internet...I have a 2001, so yours MIGHT be a little different, but.....There are 5 wires connected to the ign switch..one battery + (white wire), two lighter wires that run to the front and rear lights, one heavy wire that runs to the junction box (brown), and a lighter gray wire that runs to terminal 3 on the ecm. This is the tricky wire. According to the wiring diagram, it's there, but the legend for the ckt. pins says it's unused. This is the wire that was not getting proper voltage on mine, and caused the whole problem. The thunder ign. switch the P.O. had put on deteriorated at he connections, and the inline resistor failed. Incorrect (or no) voltage on this ckt. will cause a no start condition....cranks, spark, etc, but no fuel pump. There is a link on the mods and tips section talking about this problem. I found the link AFTER I spent way too much money and time...http://www.vulcandrifterriders.com/jobearIgnition.html
Notice that the 100ohm resistor goes into the line to the "unused" pin#3 on the ECM......

[chief]

Start at the beginning...

Ensure your battery connections are good, plugs and wires good and secure. Make sure the connections are good to the ignition switch. (I replaced a bad battery a couple of years ago... the replacement new battery was also bad - it showed full charge, but failed under load. New battery doesn't necessarily mean GOOD battery... though this is unusual. )

Try to start... if it fails, run the ECU test. (Link in previous post).

That will show any problems with: Sensors for throttle, vacuum, inlet air temp, coolant, atmospheric pressure; but also for the vehicle down sensor, pickup coils, injectors, fuel pump and ignition coils. If there are no fault codes, you can pretty much eliminate those things.

[45 Bravo]

The reason I was asking about testing is I just spent $100+ on a battery I apparently didn't need, I would hate to spend 100 on an ignition I didn't need.

Things are tight at the moment as my wife just had surgery the day before thanksgiving, and I am having surgery on the 28th.

And it is my only means of transportation. (Other than having the wife get up early and drive me to work)

Thanks for the info on the hidden feature..

Ian

[Troll]

The wiring on the switch has an interesting hidden feature. There is a resistance wire or resistor built into the circuit that sends a 5V signal to the fuel controller. They did this to prevent hot wiring and ride off thefts...That was where my thunder switch was causing the trouble. A stock switch is like $90, and comes with 2 keys that don't match your other locks...bonus!

[45 Bravo]

Mine is stock, (as far as I know)

Can you tell me this Troll.
If I direct connect the 2wires from the key switch, should it work the same? Just to test to see if it is the switch?

I have done some googling, but haven't had many hits on places that sell 1999 1500 drifter ignition..

Any idea what they cost?

Ian

[Troll]

That is exactly the same symptoms mine had. It  had a thunder ign. switch, now it has a stocker...

[45 Bravo]

ok, now the lights stay on, and the pump doesn't run at all.

I ran the test, grounded pin 37, and when i turn the ignition back on, the FI light comes on, so according to the thread,  it says there is a problem with the DFI.

any suggestions?

Ian

[chief]

http://www.vulcandrifterriders.com/ECUFaultCodes.html

This provides ecu testing info. This shows any faults in a bunch of sensors, fuel pump, injectors, coils etc. If there are any.

[45 Bravo]

Thanks for that info Troll.

so, i have been trying some trouble shooting, when i turn the key on, the fuel pump runs, then quits, the FI light, temp. and oil lights all go off.

When i hit the start switch, if the temp light, and FI light come back on, it won't start, but turn the key off, then back on, the pump runs, the lights go off, and i hit the button again, some times the lights come back on and it won't start, some times, they stay off and it fires right up.

Something is strange.

tried it 12 times in a row, it started 5 of the 12 times. the other 7 times, the FI and temp light came back on, and it would not fire.

ideas?

45 Bravo